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| Trek Checkmate SLR - Image courtesy of Trek Bikes |
A few days ago I took a look at what we had to "invent" to use for riding gravel roads. Now, just twenty years later, things have sure changed!
Looking around at what bicycles there are for gravel road riding lately is pretty bizarre. It seems as though chaos is the rule of the day when it comes to what you can get. You can spend a whole heck of a lot of money, or you can spend a lot less for a similar bicycle.
New, off the peg bikes, like this top-of-the-range Trek Checkmate SLR, go for well North of 10K. But you can get brand new, deeply discounted gravel bikes from places like Jenson USA for well South of that same 10K and get similar, or the same gear bolted to it. That's thousands of dollars difference. This seems not just significant, but really odd.
I won't even get into the used marketplace, which is rife with choices in lightly used, very high-end gravel bikes. I see these on Facebook Marketplace on the daily. I would imagine other sources have even more choices.
It is no wonder then when I see comment sections filled with angry and dismissive comments pointed at the bicycle industry. What is this stuff really worth? Take that Checkmate frame and fork, for example. Trek offers it up at a dollar less than $4,000.00. You can get a very similar frame from the Chinese company, ICAN, for a dollar less than $900.00. Now, come on! Does anyone really believe that Trek's frame and fork are $3,100.00 better?
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| Titanium Fargo - Image courtesy of Salsa Cycles |
This pricing just does not make sense, so I get why many people feel the cycling industry is a "rip-off". Try playing "The Price Is Right" with any cycling related items and you'd be hard pressed to nail the prices with any degree of consistency based on the perceived "value". How can you judge this pricing when it just doesn't add up?
Then you throw in all the major discounting that has been happening, which I have not accounted for in my examples here, and it gets even weirder. I'm all for people getting paid, but when there is no consistency, and no real innovations to point at, it becomes hard to put your trust into anything, especially when it cost thousands of dollars.
Does it surprise you then when you see sales are flat? Does it surprise you to see companies having difficult financial times? Does it surprise you to hear rumors of companies taking out huge loans to pay employees and keep things afloat? I am not surprised at all. Especially when it becomes so hard to perceive "value" when contrasted with price.
I also think that there are just far too many bicycles being produced and expected to sell every year. Every marketing trick in the book to get us to feel we need to jump on to the next shiny thing has been tried and now all the tricks have played out. Even adding gears, adding motors, and taking away cables - or hiding them - is not enough to change many people's minds anymore. There simply is just 'too much stuff' out there. We simply do not need it.
I think it is high time the game changed.
14 comments:
Also, what up with Magene? I never heard of this company till thanksgiving and I was out east and Amazon fire stick tv advertisements..
@N.Y. Roll - One of several Chinese cycling companies trying to make a dent into the US market. I had looked at their GPS device after seeing it on a You Tube channel last year.
I work in the bike industry and am amazed that a high end road bike can be offered at 15,000 dollars. As you stated, I don’t see the value in these items. There are cars and motorcycles for that price range. Everything is so saturated and the only way out is to start over again.
Lets see give Trek 15,000$ or Dave Wages 4900$*,
isn't wonderful you can save money and support American craftsmen.
*Frameset, your average American cyclist has enough parts on hand to build
at least one bike.
Q, Who hear buys bikes with parts on them, other than used ?
I did that once, and by the end of year, IIRC the BB and seat post
were all that remained of the factory build.
Is there $3100 of value in the Checkmate frame? Depends on one's perspective for sure. Trek certainly has a lot more overhead to cover in engineering, salaries, and stores than ICAN.
@S.Fuller - Yes, Trek does have a LOT more overhead. What value does any of that (Pro teams, real estate/stores, corporate structure) do for the average cyclist? I would argue that much of why Trek HAS to charge what it does is of little value, to no value, to the end user. That is kind of the point here.
Personally, I've bought a number of bikes new, with parts on them. I get to ride/enjoy the bike right away, and it gives me time to figure out where I want to spend my upgrade money and where I don't. Especially now, even "entry level spec" parts are pretty damn decent compared to years past.
Incredible post! Very very interesting. I strongly beleive that bikes prices are crazy. They are simple no justification for it. No for average riders. My only concern about China is about “competición rules”. Do chinesse companies respect the same envieronmental and health&safety standards than USA and European companies for example? Because for sure it has a cost (in Europe are making companies less competitive).
@Pedro - Thank you! As to your question concerning the environmental impacts of manufacturing in China, my best answer is that I do not know for sure.
Rumor has it that Chinese manufacturing has a lot more freedom to do things which would be considered harmful practices in Europe or in the USA. However; I think there probably are Chinese companies that pay attention to the market in both Europe and in the USA and strive to do better in regard to being cleaner and greener.
Of course, most bicycle brands have their product made in the Far East, many by the same companies you can buy direct from. Are those companies having their feet held to the fire by the European and US brands to be better? Maybe. And if not, can we say that even brands we know well are really not being environmentally friendly?
I think that "Yes" is a possible answer there.
But again, I do not know anything for certain, and it would be hard to prove things one way or the other.
Well said… It's not like that Trek is even built in the U.S. anymore. It's built in Taiwan, and while I have a (probably unfounded) preference for Taiwanese production relative to Chinese production, it's incredibly expensive for a frame produced anywhere.
I'd much rather have that Ti Fargo. Or a domestically produced frame that costs less and delivers a more personalized ride quality.
This can't be the new 'normal'. If it is, only the rich will participate… and that's no fun.
How about this instead: https://manzanitacycles.com/bikes/whippet/ ? Less expensive and the geometry looks DIALED.
@MG - I did NOT need to see THAT! Oh my! That is exactly what I would want now out of a gravel bike.
Hmmm, not sure you’re wrong but I’m seeing things a little different. I see the Bike Industry in a major state of flux, re-adjusting constantly to find next year’s big new thing and best seller. Bike Shops are changing to adjust to new Internet reality. Costs go up yearly for sure but the value in an entry level Salsa Journeyer, HeyDey Fat Bike or Giant Yukon is pretty amazing at $1100-$1500. Stout Alloy frames big enough for 50c, wide range 1x gears, juice disc brakes. Maybe The Bike Industry is paying a Karmic debt for selling 30 yrs worth of stupid skinny tire uncomfortable Tour De France race bikes instead of the much more sensible all-road capable gravel bikes we’re seeing today. Big Bike is seriously changing for sure.
Anecdotally though our local group gravel rides in Iowa are well attended, even growing, in DSM, Grinnell, and Iowa City (50-90 riders Every Monday night!). The same is happening around Lawrence KS, where my big bro Phil rides. Nationwide, The Big Events are bursting at the seams (MidSouth, Unbound, Core 4, SBT, etc). I go to a lot of these events and I’m amazed at the diversity of entrants (age, women, ethnic, LGBTQ) as well as the number of high quality (expensive) bikes. These events sure check a lot of boxes never even considered by a traditional bike road racing model, which is pretty much dead in the US. In my little Iowa town of 9k, just in the last few years, people have bought new SWorks Diverges, Crux, top of the line Laufs, Canyons, Cutthroats (lots), and Treks. We even have an active rental fleet of Salsa Journeyers for loaners and new riders to try. Getting bikes off a paved (skinny tire) bike path allows for group rides for lots of reasons. Gravel, All-Road bikes do this.
It’s easy to take a swipe at the high end bike offerings - that’s always been the case if you can’t afford or just don’t want to spend your hard earned dollars that way. I drooled over the unobtainable Campy equipped race bikes as a kid working in a restaurant, but that changed as the kid becomes a successful business owner, doctor or dentist. Recreational bikes are discretionary income purchases and are in line with snow machines, dirt bikes, boats, atvs, etc. A lot of people in the US have $5k-$15k laying around to buy a toy they might not use all the time. My Carbon everything fancy wheel battery shift Salsa Cutthroat is still LOTS cheaper than my old Gas-Gas or KTM moto race bikes (w/suspension/motor work). Have you seen what some young guys will pay for a vintage watch? Crazy. Would I pay $15k for an SWorks Crux or Epic MTB? No way, but at $5k, Specialized puts out a pretty solid value in the Epic Evo 8 MTB, with lifetime frame/wheel warranty. And if you want to save some coin and not care about a local dealer, get a Canyon, Izzy or Lauf direct. Or buy something a year or two old. Just saw a Keegan spec 1 year used Santa Cruz Stigmata for $3k at Sugar Bottom in North Liberty Iowa
@GrinnellTim - Thanks for that comment. A lot to unpack there. I'll keep it brief.
You are benefiting from the fruits of the hottest category in cycling. Gravel is one of the only growth categories in bicycles over the past five to eight years, according to data shown in "Bicycle Retailer and Industry News". So, if you are in Iowa, you see what you are seeing. This is not reality everywhere, as evidenced by troubles in the cycling industry which are well documented by stats and observers. It is not "my take" on things.
Of course, I have "my take on things" regarding the current malaise, overall, in the industry. So from a 30,000 foot view, maybe what I am opining on here makes some sense. From a "boots on the ground in Iowa" look, no. It doesn't necessarily look like that.
Enjoy things as they are now as much as you can. The only constant is change.....
Thanks again for reading the blog and for your time in commenting. I really appreciate it!
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